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kaplanaonur's avatar
kaplanaonur
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2 months ago

BER Degradation Observed When Enabling Multiple DFE-Adapted Channels on Arria 10 GX

Hello Altera Support Team / Forum Members,

We are currently conducting a comprehensive transceiver channel test on our Arria 10 GX FPGA (part number: 10AX066K4F35M3SG and 10AX066K1F35I1SG). Our test setup and configuration parameters are as follows:

Transceiver Configuration Rule: Basic (Enhanced PCS)

PMA Configuration Rule: Basic

Transceiver Mode: TX/RX Duplex

Data Rate: 10 Gbps

CDR Reference Clock Freq : 200MHz

Number of CDR Reference clocks : 1

Selected CDR reference clock : 0

Test Pattern: External PRBS31

Measurement Tool: Transceiver Toolkit (Quartus Prime 20.2)

Test Setup Description:

Our system consists of a carrier board, an FPGA board, and a passive loopback connector. The carrier board contains no active components. The FPGA board is populated with various discrete interface components—including SDRAM, SRAM, FLASH, power sequencers, oscillators, clock buffers, and clock generators—to provide all necessary interfaces for the FPGA.

The TX channels generated on the FPGA board are routed down to the carrier board, where they are looped back via the loopback connector and returned to separate RX channels on the FPGA. It should be noted that the TX and RX pairs are mostly located in different banks. The trace lengths of each channel along the loopback path vary between 8 inches and 11 inches.

Reference Clock Architecture:

We generate a 50 MHz signal using an on-board oscillator, pass it through a low-jitter clock buffer, and then feed the buffered output into a clock generator to produce the transceiver reference clocks. For the user clock, we apply a separate 100 MHz oscillator output directly to the Clkuser pin.

Observed Behavior:

During our test campaigns, we have achieved BER results on the order of 1e‑18 across many of the 36 looped‑back transceivers. In an effort to further minimize errors, we have selected pre‑emphasis, CTLE, and DFE settings within the Transceiver Toolkit that yield a zero‑error condition (i.e., no observed errors).

Critical Issue:

We are facing a significant inconsistency. When we test the 36 transceiver channels in four separate runs (9 channels per run), with VGA, EQ Control, and DFE parameters already set, we observe no errors for each channel during temperature cycling from 60 °C to 90°C (die temperature) and back down to 60 °C. Under these conditions, the BER remains zero.

However, when we increase the number of channels with DFE adaptation enabled to the range of 12 to 15, we begin to observe errors on channels that previously exhibited no errors.

Questions:

What could be causing this degradation when the number of DFE‑adapted channels is increased? Are we exceeding some power, thermal, or resource limitation? Could there be an interaction between DFE‑enabled channels in adjacent banks or through the shared clocking/power distribution networks?

Could this issue be attributed to silicon-level crosstalk between the DFE-adapted channels? More specifically, is it possible that enabling a larger number of DFE-adapted transceivers introduces additional noise coupling or interference within the FPGA silicon, potentially degrading the signal integrity of adjacent or nearby channels? If so, what would be the recommended approach to isolate or mitigate such effects in our current design and test environment?

Additionally, we would like to ask: is there a known limitation on the number of transceivers that can reliably support a 10 Gbps data rate simultaneously across a wide temperature range ? Any guidance on debugging or resolving this issue would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you in advance for your support.

Regards,

Onur

3 Replies

  • CheepinC_altera's avatar
    CheepinC_altera
    Icon for Regular Contributor rankRegular Contributor

    Hi Onur,

     

    Thank you for filing this case and sharing the details. I appreciate your patience. Please allow me some time to review the information, and I’ll get back to you as soon as possible. 

  • CheepinC_altera's avatar
    CheepinC_altera
    Icon for Regular Contributor rankRegular Contributor

    Hi Onur,


    Based on your observations, it appears that the issue may be related to a potential noise-coupling or signal-integrity effect when a larger number of channels are operating with DFE adaptation enabled. Please find my responses to your questions below.
    1. What could be causing this degradation when the number of DFE-adapted channels is increased? Are we exceeding some power, thermal, or resource limitation? Could there be an interaction between DFE-enabled channels in adjacent banks or through the shared clocking/power distribution networks?
    [CP] To help narrow down the root cause, I would recommend monitoring the device power rails when the issue occurs and verifying that all supplies remain within the recommended operating specifications.

     

    2. Could this issue be attributed to silicon-level crosstalk between the DFE-adapted channels? More specifically, is it possible that enabling a larger number of DFE-adapted transceivers introduces additional noise coupling or interference within the FPGA silicon, potentially degrading the signal integrity of adjacent or nearby channels? If so, what would be the recommended approach to isolate or mitigate such effects in our current design and test environment?
    [CP] Could you please provide more details regarding how DFE adaptation is being used in your design? For example:

    Is the DFE adaptation process being triggered manually?
    If so, at what point in the system operation is the adaptation initiated?

    Regarding the possibility of crosstalk, one potential source may be the board-level signal environment rather than the FPGA silicon itself. To help isolate the issue, I would recommend removing the external serial loopback connection and enabling the internal serial loopback feature. If the issue no longer occurs with internal loopback enabled, this would suggest that external signal-integrity factors may be contributing to the observed behavior. This test can help distinguish between board-level effects and issues originating within the device itself.

     

    3. Is there a known limitation on the number of transceivers that can reliably support a 10 Gbps data rate simultaneously across a wide temperature range?
    [CP] I am not aware of any documented limitation that restricts the number of transceivers operating at 10 Gbps under the conditions you described.
    At this stage, I would recommend performing the power-supply monitoring described in Question 1, as well as the internal serial loopback test suggested in Question 2. The results from these experiments should help further narrow down the potential root cause and determine whether the issue is related to power integrity, board-level signal integrity, or another factor.


    Please keep me updated on your findings, and I will be happy to review the results and assist with the next steps.


    Thank you.
     

  • CheepinC_altera's avatar
    CheepinC_altera
    Icon for Regular Contributor rankRegular Contributor

    Hi Onur,

     

    As it has been some time since my last response, this thread will be transitioned to community support. If you have a new question, feel free to open a new thread to get the support from Altera experts.  Thank you.