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Altera_Forum
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14 years ago

Trying to understand limitations of Web Edition tools

Hello

My robotics club is intending using De0-Nano boards with Web Edition software for some experimentation/

From what I have read so far, it would seem that the NIOS core that comes with the Web Edition has some limitations, but it is not clear what they are.

1. Functionality: Are all the NIOS build options supported? eg. building with/without MMU.

2. I see it is time limited. How long?

3. I see that there is a limitation that you can't distribute a product without a NIOS IP license. That does not limit us since we are not distributing products.

4. Are there limitations such as only being able to operate the CPU while teathered to a host?

Any other sneaky limitations I should be aware of?

Thanks

Charles

11 Replies

  • Altera_Forum's avatar
    Altera_Forum
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    14 years ago

    NIOS has 3 flavors: /e (economic), /s (standard) and /f (fast).

    The /e version is totally free nowadays. There's no time limit, no need to tether it to a host and you can distribute designs with it.

    The /s and /f versions however, are not. Unless you buy a licence, you can only run them in evaluation mode (time limit or tethered to a host).

    All features are supported.
  • Altera_Forum's avatar
    Altera_Forum
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    14 years ago

    What about multicore? Is there anyway to do this with the Web Edition? Micrium RTOS?

  • Altera_Forum's avatar
    Altera_Forum
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    14 years ago

    On top of that, what IP can I use without time/tether limitations? It seems that I can't do any of the tutorials provided with the BeMicro SDK because everything is part of a licensed Mega function... The EPCS Flash Controller and JTAG UARTs can't be used without a license!?!?! Really?

    How is a hobbiest/student ever supposed to do something cool with FPGAs when the companies selling them want to make bank on the software tools? The reason I purchased the Altera BeMicro in the first place was because Xilinx tools are obviously expensive. I thought Altera's lineup offered free embedded soft cores and everything needed to at least get started in this.

    This sucks because I want to get away from using dedicated uC's tied to separate FPGAs. Ideally, the uC would be ON the FPGA and not next to it. But how can anyone apart from a company do this in an economical way that makes sense?

    I'd be so much better off just using an NXP LPC1343 with a small Xilinx Spartan-3E for my project.

    Side note: Does anyone want to buy a lightly used BeMicro SDK? I just got it today and probably can't get any use out of it.

    Don't you guys have enough money? Can't you make your cash selling silicon and not by gouging engineers for their tools?
  • Altera_Forum's avatar
    Altera_Forum
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    14 years ago

    i don't think the EPCS Controller or JTAG UART are licensed cores. clearly you'll need to tether to use the JTAG UART anyway

  • Altera_Forum's avatar
    Altera_Forum
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    14 years ago

    and you should be able to use multiple Nios II/e cores in a system without purchasing a license, but i don't know the best way to go about it

    i think Quartus II Web Edition is quite good, the only feature i've felt like i was missing was Virtual Pins. the tethered IP evaluation or time limited untethered IP evaluation again seems very reasonable to me
  • Altera_Forum's avatar
    Altera_Forum
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    14 years ago

    I really think you don't know how to use your bemicro.

    I bought a bemicro also and i can do everything i want with it (using the web-edition) even multi-core systems with a processor running linux..
  • Altera_Forum's avatar
    Altera_Forum
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    14 years ago

    You are absolutely correct and let this be a lesson to all you kids out there that want to stay up until 4am trying to get something new to work. I took another crack at it yesterday. I started over on one of the tutorials and carefully selected what options I really wanted. I left out the Nios II/f and swapped in the 'e' version. I left out the Remote Update Controller also because I don't anticipate needing that capability.

    I generated the sopc config and loaded it on my board. Success! It did not tell me that anything I had created was time limited or limited to tethering!

    I do wish that the there was a way of easily identifying what components in SOPC builder would result in a limited system if they were included in a project without the subscription license... Maybe that already exists; if so, where is it? I think that points to the OP's initial question.

    The Quartus and Nios software tools are just so slick that I can't give up because of frustration. I shall keep at it.
  • Altera_Forum's avatar
    Altera_Forum
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    14 years ago

    --- Quote Start ---

    I really think you don't know how to use your bemicro.

    I bought a bemicro also and i can do everything i want with it (using the web-edition) even multi-core systems with a processor running linux..

    --- Quote End ---

    How are you getting away with running Linux? Are you limited to tethering? Surely you must be because Linux requires an MMU to support their concept of separate user/kernel memory spaces. Are you running uCLinux, which does not need an MMU?

    I don't plan on running Linux, but I'm really curious.
  • Altera_Forum's avatar
    Altera_Forum
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    14 years ago

    i think the web edition has many limitations, and many functions are disabled