I've got a Terasic Cyclone V GX development board. I removed the EPCQ256 configuration device and am testing two other alternatives (Macronix MX25L257 and Cypress S25FL128). I created a simple project with some LEDs and am using JTAG indirect programming to program the devices (jic file). In both cases Quartus will program the devices and verify without error, but in neither case will the FPGA configure properly at power up (active serial). nCONFIG = 3.3V CONFIG_DONE = 0V nSTATUS = 2V (?) Any thoughts?

I can confirm the Winbond W25Q128JVPIQ works fine. I gave up on Cypress. We're using the WSON 6x5 package that is a fraction of the size and cost of the Altera FLASH. Some details: 1) You need Quartus 17.1 2) You must use the IQ version of the Winbond, the IM version will not work. The IQ version defaults to Quad SPI mode. 3) The board layout and schematics are shown in the attached images. We set MSEL to "10011". 4) No changes to the quartus.ini are needed. 5) It acts exactly as a EPCQ128A. 6) The "Altera ASMI Parallel" IP works great to treat the parts of the FLASH not used for configuration as user FLASH. 7) You do NOT need to instantiate the serial flash loader in your design. It is automatically loaded by the programmer. From Cyclone V Datasheet: https://www.alteraforum.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=15081 Set "Settings -> Device/Boars ... -> Device and Pin Options ..." https://www.alteraforum.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=15082 Via File -> Convert Programming Files ... https://www.alteraforum.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=15083 After loading the .jic fine in the programmer: https://www.alteraforum.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=15084

You may refer to the Cyclone V Pin Connection Guidelines https://www.altera.com/en_us/pdfs/literature/dp/cyclone-v/pcg-01014.pdf the nCONFIG, CONF_DONE, nSTATUS should be connected to VCCPGM through an external10-kohm pull up resistor. The VCCPGM can be either 1.8V, 2.5V, 3.0V, or 3.3V.

Thanks for the reply. I'm confident he board I'm working with is wired correctly with respect to VCCPGM since; 1) It is a commercially available board from Terasic. 2) The FPGA configures correctly when an EPCQ256 configuration device is used. My question is why doesn't the FPGA configure correctly with the alternate configuration devices I experimented with, especially since they seem to program and verify without error.

This can be very problematic when you replace the flash to other models, voltage provided by different flash have different properties such as longer width and length of transistor require higher voltage theoretically to bypass the threshold(pinch-off). Especially active serial, active means your fpga is master, that you need more voltage to push longer bits to destination/slave if your slave isn't really passive device, this is the physics behind. The cyclone V itself have max voltage of 3.9V, with 3.3V is from EPCQ256 itself and 2.5V simply won't run that EPCQ256 as well when serial. For parallel, yes, around equal or greater than 2.5V you can use already. What you can play with is the voltage increment since you are very confident no wrong connection, overclocking should only shorten you device only if you turn on for a very long time which you can feel the temperature when touch or put thermometer on it. So, expecting you do it quick with overclocking to define whether this is the problem or not. Else, you may spend time comparing both flash datasheets. Are you running it on R&D since you want to replace other model to original model? Best Regards, Tzi Khang, Lim (This message was posted on behalf of Intel Corporation)

Basically, your nconfig and config_done are at correct voltage. But nstatus is wrong which need at least 3v and above while you getting 2v only. OK, let's say you really use external voltage source to make it 3v and fix the problem because transistor different width and different doping of npn junction. So, you can guess your R&D project already success powering up the fpga. No, story didn't end here because you connect it to load application, which I think only simple load like LED will success!!! You still need go through factors that high chance maybe the timing rise and fall issue leading or delay, 5ns could result a failure if you replace that LED with camera/image processing module, vsync everything failed and you will spend months troubleshoot it. Best Regards, Tzi Khang, Lim (This message was posted on behalf of Intel Corporation)

Cyclone V Configuration Devices | Altera Community

40 Replies

Altera_Forum
Honored Contributor
8 years ago
Have you looked at Cypress App Note AN200498. It says you have to tell it to ignore the Device ID of the FLASH.

We're hoping to use the Cypress chip you mention, so I hope it works. The App Note is very vague on some issues and says to contact Altera for some things like a quartus.ini file. That seemed odd. But we contacted Altera and they have no interest in helping use a competitor FLASH.

I second your comments on the Altera FLASH. Even ignoring the ridiculous price, the size ruled it out in our case. And apparently they are replacing them all with footprint compatible new chips.
multiple-attachments.zip1.3 MB
Altera_Forum
Honored Contributor
8 years ago
Yes, I tried "ignore FLASH ID" (it's actually the default setting), it didn't work.
Altera_Forum
Honored Contributor
8 years ago
Did you manage to do the other things in the app note like change the latency code and get a quartus.ini file from Altera? When we tried, the response from our FAE was:

--- Quote Start ---
Intel is not providing the .ini, apparently they reserve that for million dollar opportunities.
--- Quote End ---

Microsemi PolarFire is looking real good at the moment.
Altera_Forum
Honored Contributor
8 years ago
No, I didn't try anything else in the app note. I resigned myself to using the HUGE EPCQ256 device. It fit on the board (barely) and I had to move on.
Altera_Forum
Honored Contributor
8 years ago
--- Quote Start ---
You were able to find suitable devices for AS programming up to 64Mb, would you be willing to share these with us?
--- Quote End ---

As said I used the older Micron devices, both 64 and 256 MBit in different designs, which are now obsolete. For some reason (EPCQ compatibility) we preferred the large SO16 package.

I identified possible replacement devices, but I didn't yet test it.
Altera_Forum
Honored Contributor
8 years ago
--- Quote Start ---
Have you looked at Cypress App Note AN200498. It says you have to tell it to ignore the Device ID of the FLASH.
--- Quote End ---

Thanks for the Cypress App Notes. I find myself in a similar situation. We have been using N25Q128 in a previous design and would like to find a direct replacement in SOIC-8. I have tested Winbond W25Q128JV and program + verify works but it does not boot. Have you found a working solution already? I think I will try Cypress S25FL128S if I can find one. The availability of small flash chips in SOIC-8 is quite poor in general.
Altera_Forum
Honored Contributor
8 years ago
Look at this thread, it might help; https://www.alteraforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41079
Altera_Forum
Honored Contributor
8 years ago
ilkkak,

Our FAE says the Winbond W25QxxJV series should work but you have to use Quartus 17.1 that came out recently and set the config device to EPCQ128A in the tools. No quartus.ini should be needed. Were you using 17.1?

We're in the middle of designing a new board with the Winbond part since the Cypress is way to complicated. So I 'm hoping it works.
Altera_Forum
Honored Contributor
8 years ago
We got Winbond in WSON 6x5 mm package, which is about 2 mm shorter than the SOIC-8. They were readily available and cheap.

Not sure if it works yet though!
Altera_Forum
Honored Contributor
8 years ago
--- Quote Start ---
Our FAE says the Winbond W25QxxJV series should work but you have to use Quartus 17.1 that came out recently and set the config device to EPCQ128A in the tools. No quartus.ini should be needed. Were you using 17.1?
--- Quote End ---

I tried with 17.0 and 14.1 and EPCQ128. The Quartus download has been down for a couple of days, so I haven't been able to test 17.1 yet.

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Cyclone V Configuration Devices

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